1111

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Thanks, I agree with what you said about getting more midface projection. In regards to what you said about the dropping the gonial angles -- are you saying it wouldn't look good to have lower gonial angles without a more compact midface?
I can tell from your pictures that you are carrying quite a bit of body fat (especially looking at your cheeks, neck and arms). Even models don't get those lines on their face until they are very lean.

I would first try to get as lean as possible and then evaluate whether you need to revise the midface implants. You could get filler on top of your current implants to see how it would look before committing to a revision.

My opinion, if you care, is that that your implants are great and you shouldn't revise them. They looked super prominent in some of your earlier pictures when you were a bit leaner, and would look even better if you lost more fat. 8.5 mm would be way to big for a cheek implant and you would definitely look overstuffed. Facial definition is a combination of bone structure and leanness, don't try to compensate for a lack of leanness with oversized implants.
 

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Thanks, I agree with what you said about getting more midface projection. In regards to what you said about the dropping the gonial angles -- are you saying it wouldn't look good to have lower gonial angles without a more compact midface?
no, what I meant was that dropping your gonial angle would be good.

Im just saying that your long midface does kind of fuck you over abit and prevent you from imitating the Henry Cavill look to perfection, along with your eyes and foward growth ofcourse.
 

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no, what I meant was that dropping your gonial angle would be good.

Im just saying that your long midface does kind of fuck you over abit and prevent you from imitating the Henry Cavill look to perfection, along with your eyes and foward growth ofcourse.
I agree, I wish there was a way to legitimately shorten my midface. In your opinion, do I actually qualify as having what most people would call a "long face?" Or is it only mildly too long?
 

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I can tell from your pictures that you are carrying quite a bit of body fat (especially looking at your cheeks, neck and arms). Even models don't get those lines on their face until they are very lean.

I would first try to get as lean as possible and then evaluate whether you need to revise the midface implants. You could get filler on top of your current implants to see how it would look before committing to a revision.

My opinion, if you care, is that that your implants are great and you shouldn't revise them. They looked super prominent in some of your earlier pictures when you were a bit leaner, and would look even better if you lost more fat. 8.5 mm would be way to big for a cheek implant and you would definitely look overstuffed. Facial definition is a combination of bone structure and leanness, don't try to compensate for a lack of leanness with oversized implants.
Thanks for the compliment on the implants, but I was actually just as lean in the earlier photos as I am now (I literally haven't changed anything about my diet or exercise routine as compared to what it was when those photos were taken). I think that they looked a bit leaner in the earlier photos because there was probably still a bit of swelling still remaining in my cheeks, which probably made the implants look more "tight" against the skin. From looking at the oblique-perspective photo I uploaded on the previous page, you don't think that the ogee curve is less prominent than it could be (as someone else pointed out)?
 

1111

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Thanks for the compliment on the implants, but I was actually just as lean in the earlier photos as I am now (I literally haven't changed anything about my diet or exercise routine as compared to what it was when those photos were taken). I think that they looked a bit leaner in the earlier photos because there was probably still a bit of swelling still remaining in my cheeks, which probably made the implants look more "tight" against the skin. From looking at the oblique-perspective photo I uploaded on the previous page, you don't think that the ogee curve is less prominent than it could be (as someone else pointed out)?
Well regardless you should get significantly leaner. Your ogee curve is not as prominent because of the fat you have in your lower cheeks. The top part of the curve (over the implants) is great, but the bottom part of the curve doesn't curve "in" towards your mouth.

I'm not saying to rule out a revision (even though I think you shouldn't), I'm just saying that you should get leaner and then evaluate. It's very easy to get an unnatural/overdone look with cheek implants, so you should be careful. I would hate for you to get the revision, have them look weird, and then have to go back for a third revision.
 

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Well regardless you should get significantly leaner. Your ogee curve is not as prominent because of the fat you have in your lower cheeks. The top part of the curve (over the implants) is great, but the bottom part of the curve doesn't curve "in" towards your mouth.

I'm not saying to rule out a revision (even though I think you shouldn't), I'm just saying that you should get leaner and then evaluate. It's very easy to get an unnatural/overdone look with cheek implants, so you should be careful. I would hate for you to get the revision, have them look weird, and then have to go back for a third revision.
Actually, I would say that the top part of the ogee curve doesn't project enough, but what I really want the revision for is to get more forward projection (I.e., the kind of projection I would see when looking head-on into a mirror), like what you see with guys like Henry Cavill. I'm going to send photos to Dr. Y and ask him if an extra 2-3 mm would make my cheeks look overstuffed. If he thinks my face can handle an extra few mm, I think I'm going to go for it and have the revision done during the same surgery to have the rest of my wraparound jaw implant placed.
 

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Sorry for the delay in responding. Looks like you've made great progress! Congratulations on the weight loss; I think it really made a difference in allowing your facial bone structure to become more noticeable. It also seems like it improved your skin. Also, it sounds like you have a great job now, so I guess if you ever did decide that you wanted to get surgeries abroad, you could afford to finance them without too much difficulty. As for me, I'm looking at going back to my original surgeon to have the remaining two pieces of my wraparound jaw implant placed in March, and I'm still on the fence as to whether or not I want to have my midface implants revised. Since having wider/lower jaw angles will help stretch out my midface tissues and make the current midface implants more noticeable, I might wait 3-4 months to see how the wraparound jaw implant affects the appearance of my midface before opting for a revision of my midface implants. Then, the next surgery after that will definitely be my eye area overhaul. The only reason I'm doing the rest of the jaw implant first is because my surgeon is rather old (either 70 or 71) and is much more likely to either retire or die before Dr. Taban or any of the other well-reputed oculoplastic surgeons who are all in their 40s or 50s.
It's fine really, as I'm definitely more guilty of it than you.


The only surgery I might get is facial liposuction to see what I truly look like without needing to get down to 12% bf or less. I'm simply not as motivated as you to look better, especially given the fact that I have a much worse genetic base than you. Also, I just noticed a few days ago that the norwood reaper had come back for another visit; The right side of my hairline had been receding and losing density the past few months without me noticing. It only really became apparent this past week because I let my hair grow long enough for me to notice the recession ( you're not allowed to grow your hair in a military bootcamp ). I flat out refuse to use anti-androgens because of the cognitive side effects I experienced when I tried them two years ago, which means I'm destined for NW2.5 or even 3 in 5 years or less. Throw in aspie and adult love-shy virgin into the mix and you have a truecel who never really stood a chance. I'm here to follow your journey out of curiosity, that's pretty much it. My involvement in PSL is that of an observer who has nothing to gain or lose.



As for your recent photos, your zygos don't protrude as much as you'd like because of fat deposits on your cheeks. I'm probably the only one here to tell you it isn't a pressing issue at all, as the results of the implant are still apparent. You do have visible zygos, but without the hollow cheeks seen in people with single digit bf%. It really isn't a big deal at all. I know this because I've met a lot of slayers without it. They all were medium bf% or lower though, and every single one of them ( no exceptions ) had these traits/characteristics, in descending order of prominence:

Youth ( early 30s or younger, especially mid 20s or younger )

Harmony and bones ( joint 2nd )

Eye area and a dense NW1 ( joint 3rd ).

Dimorphism. This one seems to be a cut-off trait. You either meet the threshold or you don't. It's exactly like height. You don't need to be 6'3 to slay, assuming you aren't below average male height. Similarly, You don't have to look like a male with a massive dose of pre-natal testoterone, a moderate level of facial dimorphism is enough.


I'd focus on looking early 30s for as long as humanly possible if I were you, and do something about your hairline. If this isn't the hairline you've had since your mid or late 20s, then you are norwooding. No doubt in my mind. Your hair is starting to resemble a deep NW2, assuming the right side ( from a third person perspective ) paints an accurate picture of the left side and the rest of your hairline, including your temples.


Of course, your eye area overhaul has to be done asap. I wouldn't risk postponing it in order to do the implant revision if you don't know when the surgeon will retire. This is all assuming you're doing this to slay. In which case, time is of the essence. You will look considerably older 3 years from now, which means you must be done with all of this within about a year.
 

MudslimeMo

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I agree, I wish there was a way to legitimately shorten my midface. In your opinion, do I actually qualify as having what most people would call a "long face?" Or is it only mildly too long?


You don't have a long midface at all, not even close. Also, your fwhr is great. I forgot to ask: what happened with your post wall colleague and her search for a " serious " relationship? Has the CC rider managed to trap a late 30s oldcel beta provider? Is she dating some desperate nice guy?
 

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It's fine really, as I'm definitely more guilty of it than you.


The only surgery I might get is facial liposuction to see what I truly look like without needing to get down to 12% bf or less. I'm simply not as motivated as you to look better, especially given the fact that I have a much worse genetic base than you. Also, I just noticed a few days ago that the norwood reaper had come back for another visit; The right side of my hairline had been receding and losing density the past few months without me noticing. It only really became apparent this past week because I let my hair grow long enough for me to notice the recession ( you're not allowed to grow your hair in a military bootcamp ). I flat out refuse to use anti-androgens because of the cognitive side effects I experienced when I tried them two years ago, which means I'm destined for NW2.5 or even 3 in 5 years or less. Throw in aspie and adult love-shy virgin into the mix and you have a truecel who never really stood a chance. I'm here to follow your journey out of curiosity, that's pretty much it. My involvement in PSL is that of an observer who has nothing to gain or lose.



As for your recent photos, your zygos don't protrude as much as you'd like because of fat deposits on your cheeks. I'm probably the only one here to tell you it isn't a pressing issue at all, as the results of the implant are still apparent. You do have visible zygos, but without the hollow cheeks seen in people with single digit bf%. It really isn't a big deal at all. I know this because I've met a lot of slayers without it. They all were medium bf% or lower though, and every single one of them ( no exceptions ) had these traits/characteristics, in descending order of prominence:

Youth ( early 30s or younger, especially mid 20s or younger )

Harmony and bones ( joint 2nd )

Eye area and a dense NW1 ( joint 3rd ).

Dimorphism. This one seems to be a cut-off trait. You either meet the threshold or you don't. It's exactly like height. You don't need to be 6'3 to slay, assuming you aren't below average male height. Similarly, You don't have to look like a male with a massive dose of pre-natal testoterone, a moderate level of facial dimorphism is enough.


I'd focus on looking early 30s for as long as humanly possible if I were you, and do something about your hairline. If this isn't the hairline you've had since your mid or late 20s, then you are norwooding. No doubt in my mind. Your hair is starting to resemble a deep NW2, assuming the right side ( from a third person perspective ) paints an accurate picture of the left side and the rest of your hairline, including your temples.


Of course, your eye area overhaul has to be done asap. I wouldn't risk postponing it in order to do the implant revision if you don't know when the surgeon will retire. This is all assuming you're doing this to slay. In which case, time is of the essence. You will look considerably older 3 years from now, which means you must be done with all of this within about a year.
A couple questions for you -- which photos are you looking at when you say that I'm definitely norwooding? Is it the original photos I posted at the beginning of this thread? Because when I pull up my hair and look at my temples, the hairline literally looks exactly the same as it did a few years ago, as far as I can tell.

Also, when you say that I'll look significantly older in 3 years, are you basing that on any current signs of aging that are visible in my photos? Or is that just based on the fact that age 35 is generally considered the age when most males start to look much older?

Unfortunately, because of a number of factors, I might not be able to financially afford to get the eye area overhaul done within the next year, and I might not be able to make the move to a larger city I was hoping to be able to make, either, so if I really am destined to start looking significantly older in a few years, then I might just have to get these procedures done with the mindset of wanting to do them for my own personal satisfaction and not because I think they'll result in me being attractive to women. The ship might have simply sailed by the time I'm able to finally get everything done. FWIW, even though I know that I don't actually pass for someone in his late-20's, literally everyone I met IRL guesses my age to be around 28, so there's that (I'm guessing this is because there are plenty of white males who are in their late 20's who actually have significantly worse skin than me).

On the topic of zygo implants, do you think getting a revision to add a few extra mm of augmentation will actually make them look overdone/uncanny? I know you said I don't "need" the extra projection, but I'd like to get it just for my own personal satisfaction.

To answer your question, the classmate apparently resumed dating the beta friend of a bad boy she used to hook up with a couple years ago sometime in the fall (so a few months ago). She had actually started dating him after she ended the regular hookup sessions with the bad boy a couple years ago, broke up with him after something like 6-8 months, and then stayed single for an extended period of time before getting back together with him just a few months ago. He's actually younger than her by at least 4 or 5 years, I believe.
 

MudslimeMo

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1 - A couple questions for you -- which photos are you looking at when you say that I'm definitely norwooding? Is it the original photos I posted at the beginning of this thread? Because when I pull up my hair and look at my temples, the hairline literally looks exactly the same as it did a few years ago, as far as I can tell.

2 - Also, when you say that I'll look significantly older in 3 years, are you basing that on any current signs of aging that are visible in my photos? Or is that just based on the fact that age 35 is generally considered the age when most males start to look much older?

3 - Unfortunately, because of a number of factors, I might not be able to financially afford to get the eye area overhaul done within the next year, and I might not be able to make the move to a larger city I was hoping to be able to make, either, so if I really am destined to start looking significantly older in a few years, then I might just have to get these procedures done with the mindset of wanting to do them for my own personal satisfaction and not because I think they'll result in me being attractive to women. The ship might have simply sailed by the time I'm able to finally get everything done. FWIW, even though I know that I don't actually pass for someone in his late-20's, literally everyone I met IRL guesses my age to be around 28, so there's that (I'm guessing this is because there are plenty of white males who are in their late 20's who actually have significantly worse skin than me).

4 - On the topic of zygo implants, do you think getting a revision to add a few extra mm of augmentation will actually make them look overdone/uncanny? I know you said I don't "need" the extra projection, but I'd like to get it just for my own personal satisfaction.

To answer your question, the classmate apparently resumed dating the beta friend of a bad boy she used to hook up with a couple years ago sometime in the fall (so a few months ago). She had actually started dating him after she ended the regular hookup sessions with the bad boy a couple years ago, broke up with him after something like 6-8 months, and then stayed single for an extended period of time before getting back together with him just a few months ago. He's actually younger than her by at least 4 or 5 years, I believe.

1 - I looked at the recent photos. I had also mentioned that you did not have a solid NW1 way back when this thread started. Obviously, you would only be norwooding if your deep recession is a fairly recent development, beyond hairline maturation typically seen in one's mid 20s. I'm unconvinced that it's just maturation, because it is undeniably deeper than NW1. Alternatively, it could be non-aggressive MPB, the kind of norwooding some lucky men get where they stop at NW2.5. You will not notice the recession easily - if at all - if you have not cut your hair off for years. You also need very clear pictures of your mid or late 20s hairline to get a good idea about where you stand. The only thing keeping up the illusion of a strong NW1 is your excellent density. Cut off your hair and take a picture, then let it grow and cut it off again a year later and take an other pic. This is one of the few reliable ways to tell if your receding or not. If you take a look at my recent photo, you could clearly see that I'm approaching NW2. You don't even need to have a keen eye for balding to notice a wide arched M shape forming, with my hairline at the center receding rapidly. The only reason I still look like a NW1 is because I still have non recessed hair away from the center/widows peak. Once that's gone, I will be a deep NW2.


2 - I have had many instances where I bump into people I haven't seen for 3 or 4 years. They all went from one age group to the next one facially. The only exception to this is a guy I saw a few months ago whom I hadn't seen in 4 years. He looked exactly the same and didn't age a day. That guy was most likely an anomaly genetically, and he also had darker than normal skin pigmentation for a Caucasian, something that definitely helps. Additionally, I correctly guessed that one of your old photos was taken much earlier than the others. I guessed your age in that photo at early late 20s. Even you were impressed by how accurate I was. You said something to the effect of " good job at guessing that photo as having been taken 4 years prior to the rest ". I'm usually accurate at guessing age, which is something I do not take pride in, because most people are also accurate. The bootcamp proved that to me. Every single guy there guessed my age more or less accurately, with most guessing 28-30 ( I'm six months away from being 30 btw ). The youngest guess I got was 27. By contrast, two years ago, I got mid 20s quite often ( I was around 27 ), with no one ever guessing more than 28. Now, two years later, I never get mid 20s. At all. I have aged two or three years facially in the past 24-30 months, which is backed up by empirical, hard evidence. You will almost certainly look considerably older 3 years from now. You're white, ageing well isn't something you should be optimistic about.


3 - You don't look 28 at all to me. You look like a guy in the very beginning of his 30s. I'll have my brother take a look at your photos and guess your age to see whether or not I'm being too harsh. Your skin quality has very little to do with how old you look. It's the underlying soft tissue that does, in addition to collagen. A guy with acne ridden, abysmal skin quality will still look 24 if that's his age. A 35 y/o with pristine skin will still look 35. That's why facelifts target the muscles underneath the skin to achieve the desired effect of looking younger.


4 - I don't think you will look uncanny enough for people to notice. I just think a revision should be very low priority.
 

MudslimeMo

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I guessed this foid's age with good accuracy, given that she's caked up to the bone. I even noticed she looked very subtly different and older - I didn't look at the upload date - than she did in another song of hers I remember listening to last year. In the old song, I correctly guessed 19-21. In this song, I guessed 24, only missing the mark by 2 years ( true age 22 ).



She was born in 1998. The videos are basically 3 years apart.


Older ( end of early 20s )




Younger ( just out of her teens )




I noticed the reduction of full cheeks instantly ( it's a sign of youth. You will be glad you have some face fat in your 30s ). Also, she seems to have worse under eye support. I'm not sure these changes can be explained by weight loss alone.
 

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1 - I looked at the recent photos. I had also mentioned that you did not have a solid NW1 way back when this thread started. Obviously, you would only be norwooding if your deep recession is a fairly recent development, beyond hairline maturation typically seen in one's mid 20s. I'm unconvinced that it's just maturation, because it is undeniably deeper than NW1. Alternatively, it could be non-aggressive MPB, the kind of norwooding some lucky men get where they stop at NW2.5. You will not notice the recession easily - if at all - if you have not cut your hair off for years. You also need very clear pictures of your mid or late 20s hairline to get a good idea about where you stand. The only thing keeping up the illusion of a strong NW1 is your excellent density. Cut off your hair and take a picture, then let it grow and cut it off again a year later and take an other pic. This is one of the few reliable ways to tell if your receding or not. If you take a look at my recent photo, you could clearly see that I'm approaching NW2. You don't even need to have a keen eye for balding to notice a wide arched M shape forming, with my hairline at the center receding rapidly. The only reason I still look like a NW1 is because I still have non recessed hair away from the center/widows peak. Once that's gone, I will be a deep NW2.


2 - I have had many instances where I bump into people I haven't seen for 3 or 4 years. They all went from one age group to the next one facially. The only exception to this is a guy I saw a few months ago whom I hadn't seen in 4 years. He looked exactly the same and didn't age a day. That guy was most likely an anomaly genetically, and he also had darker than normal skin pigmentation for a Caucasian, something that definitely helps. Additionally, I correctly guessed that one of your old photos was taken much earlier than the others. I guessed your age in that photo at early late 20s. Even you were impressed by how accurate I was. You said something to the effect of " good job at guessing that photo as having been taken 4 years prior to the rest ". I'm usually accurate at guessing age, which is something I do not take pride in, because most people are also accurate. The bootcamp proved that to me. Every single guy there guessed my age more or less accurately, with most guessing 28-30 ( I'm six months away from being 30 btw ). The youngest guess I got was 27. By contrast, two years ago, I got mid 20s quite often ( I was around 27 ), with no one ever guessing more than 28. Now, two years later, I never get mid 20s. At all. I have aged two or three years facially in the past 24-30 months, which is backed up by empirical, hard evidence. You will almost certainly look considerably older 3 years from now. You're white, ageing well isn't something you should be optimistic about.


3 - You don't look 28 at all to me. You look like a guy in the very beginning of his 30s. I'll have my brother take a look at your photos and guess your age to see whether or not I'm being too harsh. Your skin quality has very little to do with how old you look. It's the underlying soft tissue that does, in addition to collagen. A guy with acne ridden, abysmal skin quality will still look 24 if that's his age. A 35 y/o with pristine skin will still look 35. That's why facelifts target the muscles underneath the skin to achieve the desired effect of looking younger.


4 - I don't think you will look uncanny enough for people to notice. I just think a revision should be very low priority.
Regarding the hair, I honestly just think it's how I pushed my hair back prior to taking the photos you referenced. When I pull my hair up to show the hairline, it doesn't go past the temples at all. It IS definitely higher than it used to be 4-5 years ago, but I don't think it's any higher than it was back in July 2018. I actually took a photo of my hairline back then that I'll see if I can find so I can post it here. I know what you mean in regards to the sharp point that is visible in the upper right portion of my hairline, but I honestly just think that's where I tried to part the hair prior to taking a picture. Like I said, I'll see if I can find the photo I took back in July 2018 and post it here.

On the topic of looking older -- since you mentioned facelifts, that reminded me of something. The surgeon I will most likely be going to for my eye area overhaul surgery (if I can ever get the money together for it) said that during my surgery, he will do a type of "mini" facelift that will lift and resuspend the fat pads under my eyes that have started to descend over the last few years. This is very noticeable in at least several of my photos (especially the ones taken in front of the mirror illuminated by orange-ish light), where you can basically see what appear to be descending lines about an inch or so under my eyes. According to the oculoplastic surgeon, the facelift he'll perform will result in those sagging undereye fat pads being resuspended to where they previously were. Even though the results won't be permanent (I.e., the fat pads will eventually descend again), at least that's one that I think is largely responsible for making me look old that will largely be reversed, at least temporarily.

It's also worth mentioning that during my first surgeries, I had a midface lift performed that involved the midface tissues (at the level of the periosteum) being stitched permanently to my midface implants. According to the medical literature that has been published on the procedure, this is supposed to be the longest-lasting type of facelift thanks to the stitching (some sources even say the effects are permanent), so if the effects of the midface lift really are as long-lasting as sources claim, then at the very least, I shouldn't have to worry about experiencing anymore midface descent for a very long time. So in other words, when other guys' midfaces are beginning to sag noticeably during their mid-30s, hopefully I'll be spared from exhibiting that same phenomenon, at least for a few more years.

BTW, I am also continuing to use Retin-A, which is proven to boost collagen/elastin production. Supposedly, the collagen-boosting effects really become noticeable after 3 years of regular use, which will be in about 1.5 years from now for me. Here is a before/after example of someone who applied it every night for 3 years:


Anyways, it's not a miracle product, but as you can see (or at least IMO), the lady doesn't look significantly older in the "after" photo than she does in the original photo. I'm not saying that I'm not going to age at all, and like you suggested, I'm not particularly optimistic about aging well... however, I DO hope to maybe age not quite as badly as I otherwise would have thanks to the (soon to be two) facelifts as well as my use of Retin-A.
 

MudslimeMo

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Regarding the hair, I honestly just think it's how I pushed my hair back prior to taking the photos you referenced. When I pull my hair up to show the hairline, it doesn't go past the temples at all. It IS definitely higher than it used to be 4-5 years ago, but I don't think it's any higher than it was back in July 2018. I actually took a photo of my hairline back then that I'll see if I can find so I can post it here. I know what you mean in regards to the sharp point that is visible in the upper right portion of my hairline, but I honestly just think that's where I tried to part the hair prior to taking a picture. Like I said, I'll see if I can find the photo I took back in July 2018 and post it here.

On the topic of looking older -- since you mentioned facelifts, that reminded me of something. The surgeon I will most likely be going to for my eye area overhaul surgery (if I can ever get the money together for it) said that during my surgery, he will do a type of "mini" facelift that will lift and resuspend the fat pads under my eyes that have started to descend over the last few years. This is very noticeable in at least several of my photos (especially the ones taken in front of the mirror illuminated by orange-ish light), where you can basically see what appear to be descending lines about an inch or so under my eyes. According to the oculoplastic surgeon, the facelift he'll perform will result in those sagging undereye fat pads being resuspended to where they previously were. Even though the results won't be permanent (I.e., the fat pads will eventually descend again), at least that's one that I think is largely responsible for making me look old that will largely be reversed, at least temporarily.

It's also worth mentioning that during my first surgeries, I had a midface lift performed that involved the midface tissues (at the level of the periosteum) being stitched permanently to my midface implants. According to the medical literature that has been published on the procedure, this is supposed to be the longest-lasting type of facelift thanks to the stitching (some sources even say the effects are permanent), so if the effects of the midface lift really are as long-lasting as sources claim, then at the very least, I shouldn't have to worry about experiencing anymore midface descent for a very long time. So in other words, when other guys' midfaces are beginning to sag noticeably during their mid-30s, hopefully I'll be spared from exhibiting that same phenomenon, at least for a few more years.

BTW, I am also continuing to use Retin-A, which is proven to boost collagen/elastin production. Supposedly, the collagen-boosting effects really become noticeable after 3 years of regular use, which will be in about 1.5 years from now for me. Here is a before/after example of someone who applied it every night for 3 years:


Anyways, it's not a miracle product, but as you can see (or at least IMO), the lady doesn't look significantly older in the "after" photo than she does in the original photo. I'm not saying that I'm not going to age at all, and like you suggested, I'm not particularly optimistic about aging well... however, I DO hope to maybe age not quite as badly as I otherwise would have thanks to the (soon to be two) facelifts as well as my use of Retin-A.


I wasn't able to respond the past few days because of an inexplicably erratic sleep pattern.


You wouldn't have a sharp point that deep in a true NW1, even if it's only visible when you part your hair. I know this because your hairline resembles my brother's almost exactly. It looks like a NW1 because of how dense and long it is, but when he pulls it back, the recession is obvious. He even told me himself that his hairline has receded a lot and that it used to be straight across along the forehead. Your hairline is similar to Ashton Kutcher's in this video .
The guy is norwooding by his own admission. I'm not trying to unsettle you, and I really want to be mistaken about your hair for my own sake and peace of mind knowing that this is my future hairline, but it's always safer and wiser to assume the worst case scenario, especially if it's NOT far-fetched or overly pessimistic at all.



About the agepill, I do think that it can be artificially slowed down, even if you don't have the genetic predisposition to age well. What I've been trying to get at is that it's extremely difficult to look more than 3 years younger than you actually are, especially if you have fair skin. The last observation seems to hold true whether you're 100% white Caucasian, or have negroid admixture ( Arab, Berber ). I definitely see it in my country. The lighter the pigmentation, the worse the ageing process tends to get. Syrians and white Gulfies age the worst in the middle east, and blacks the best. However, even for the latter, you rarely see someone looking 35 at 40 or even 38. Facelifts are unheard of here, particularly among men, so I can't really say anything about their effectiveness. When I say effective, I mean shaving off a good 4 or 5 years off your face. If you don't look 31 or 32 at 35 or 36, what's the point really? You'd need to know how common it is to look that much younger ( there is a huge difference between 31 and 35 for the average guy. They're almost worlds apart ) to justify dumping several thousand $s into a facelift and/or an anti-ageing regimen. Not only will you sink further in debt - in your particular case - you will also get sick of sticking to the regimen and the need to avoid certain diet pitfalls in order to get and maintain potential results. It's only worth the hassle if you have a pretty good chance at looking your current age 4 years from now. However, since this is your last chance to salvage what's left of your youth, I'd say go for it, considering that you don't have much to lose. Of course, I'm assuming that you're confident you can pay all the money you owe back. How deep are you in debt if you don't mind me asking? And what about your earning potential once you're done with your studies? If it's too personal, I understand if you decline to answer.


It's going to be interesting to see where you end up with all of this. The eye area overhaul is going to define an era for the redpill and the internet manosphere if it's successful and gets enough exposure. If you end up with a looksmatched mid 20s gf who is moderately attracted to you, let alone ascend to serial fucktoy status, you will have succeeded, considering you come from a background of total or near total inceldom.
 

MudslimeMo

Incel
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Oct 22, 2018
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This is what I mean by unsuccessful anti ageing:














She's 27 here but can pass for mid 20s easily in all but her last photo which gives away her age. She really should look closer to 23 with the countless cocktails of creams and celebrity-tier plastic surgery she has access to.
 

Surgerymax

confirmed surgeon
Joined
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This is what I mean by unsuccessful anti ageing:














She's 27 here but can pass for mid 20s easily in all but her last photo which gives away her age. She really should look closer to 23 with the countless cocktails of creams and celebrity-tier plastic surgery she has access to.
I believe she has lupus
 

albert_camus

Incel
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:tyson:

op is clearly mentally scarred from not getting much (if any) pussy during his prime years

thats why he acts so irrational and doesnt just get eye surgery

thats the whole reason he is going for that new implant because he is secretely hoping to reach chad territory to compensate for his wasted youth

thats why he is so desperate about looking younger then he actually is (doesnt work) and why he wastes ton of money on useless skin products

and thats why he is disappointed about the first implant results. because his expectation were too high. because he secretely hoped for chad results. because he secretely wished to slay prime women and to compensate for his wasted youth.

besides: just fucking lol if you are going to the 40 and still think you have time for perfectionism (muh 2mm)

reality check: if you wait much longer you dont even need eye surgery anymore because at a certain age women (and you will NEVER get prime jb) only look at money and status aka betabuxx and looks doesnt matter anymore so much to them

:autism:
 

SurgerySoon

Got Custom Implants
Joined
Sep 11, 2018
Messages
850
Reputation
22
:tyson:

op is clearly mentally scarred from not getting much (if any) pussy during his prime years

thats why he acts so irrational and doesnt just get eye surgery

thats the whole reason he is going for that new implant because he is secretely hoping to reach chad territory to compensate for his wasted youth

thats why he is so desperate about looking younger then he actually is (doesnt work) and why he wastes ton of money on useless skin products

and thats why he is disappointed about the first implant results. because his expectation were too high. because he secretely hoped for chad results. because he secretely wished to slay prime women and to compensate for his wasted youth.

besides: just fucking lol if you are going to the 40 and still think you have time for perfectionism (muh 2mm)

reality check: if you wait much longer you dont even need eye surgery anymore because at a certain age women (and you will NEVER get prime jb) only look at money and status aka betabuxx and looks doesnt matter anymore so much to them

:autism:
So the Retin-A and other skin products don't work? I'm not sure how an incel who lives in his parents' basement and spends his time posting on incel forums was able to come to a conclusion from off out of nowhere that directly conflicts with what the the results of millions of dollars worth of university-level research have found, but if it really doesn't work then I'd rather stop wasting my money.